00:44.8
So karamihan sa amin, mixed nationality kami.
00:48.3
So we have Filipino members, we have members from all over the world.
00:51.9
But all of us, and we have freelancers also.
00:54.2
Generally, yung mga members ng FOCAP, nagsusulat po whether in staff capacity
00:58.6
or as freelancers or contractors para sa different news organizations
01:04.2
who come from all over the world.
01:06.8
So the US, Europe, and even other countries in Asia, such as Japan and China as well.
01:16.1
So ano lang, ma-disabuse natin yung utak ng iba na pag sinabi yung FOCAP,
01:20.0
hindi po sila puro foreigner. Karamihan po diyan Pilipino.
01:22.8
Ayan, Pilipino po si Regine. Pinay na Pinay yan si Regine.
01:27.0
So basically, yung audience ng FOCAP,
01:28.6
journalist, the world.
01:31.9
Okay, hindi lang Pilipinas.
01:33.7
Okay, talk to us about this.
01:36.9
Lumabas ang statement d'yo recently na you're basically raising the
01:40.7
raising alarm over the malign influence operations indicative of foreign interference.
01:46.5
Tumbukan na natin, China ba ito?
01:49.7
Well, ito yung mahirap sabihin, Christian.
01:53.1
Kasi syempre, yung attacks na na-record namin, puro anonymous yan.
01:56.7
Or rather, they have to do with South China Sea or they're targeting journalists covering South China Sea.
02:05.4
Pero hindi natin masasabi kung kanino ba talaga galing yung source.
02:09.9
What we can do is just infer. Kaya ginamit po natin yung word na indicative of foreign interference.
02:16.3
So to kind of walk you guys through kung ano yung mga sample ng mga threats na na-encounter natin sa mga members natin.
02:24.9
Yung isa na na-mention dyan sa statement.
02:28.2
Impersonation or spoofing.
02:30.2
So nag-record kami ng isang case where a journalist from a member agency of FOCAP
02:37.9
parang nagkaroon ng fake email sa isang government agency claiming to be that journalist,
02:45.1
claiming to be a foreign correspondent, trying to fish for information on South China Sea.
02:50.4
Pero pinadala yun from a Google email at hindi galing sa company email.
02:56.7
Wait, sorry Regina.
02:57.9
But when you say fish information about the West Philippine Sea,
03:01.8
ano yung nature? Ano yung information na gusto niya makuha? At anong government agency ito?
03:06.2
Okay. The government agency, I'm not sure if I'm at liberty actually to disclose what government agency it is.
03:13.7
But yun, sabihin na natin it's a government agency.
03:16.6
But they didn't respond to that particular email.
03:21.8
We'll have to ask, of course, for the consent ng member at agency concerned.
03:26.7
But we're still in the fact-finding process.
03:28.5
So that's why very general pa muna yung statement natin while we're still trying to go through the details din with our members.
03:36.7
Give us an idea on how grave the situation was.
03:41.5
Kasi medyo nakakaalam yung sinasabi nyo, no?
03:44.0
So meron nagpanggap na kunwari, journalist na ito.
03:48.3
Tapos sumulat sa isang government agency, kumukuha ng detalya tungkol sa West Philippine Sea.
03:53.6
Basically, name person, yan kaya ginagamit kayo.
03:56.7
Example na yun, that particular journalist.
03:59.1
So nakakaalarm yun kasi kung medyo na-auto yung government agency, pwede mag-release ng information, di ba?
04:07.5
That's true. And that's why also we released the statement.
04:11.0
Para magiging aware, not only yung public, also government agents.
04:16.6
It's a cue to all the people who might be working with FOCAP to double-check and verify if journalists reach out to them and try to see, no?
04:25.2
If you know any of our members.
04:26.7
Try to cross-check, precisely because we recorded a case like this.
04:31.7
At may danger yan.
04:33.2
So we're still trying to find the facts, pero sa pagkakaalam ko, if I recall correctly, in this particular case,
04:41.7
it was trying to seek information or some form of comment from this agency regarding an issue related to South China Sea.
04:51.3
However, hindi nga nag-respond yung government because they found the email suspicious.
04:55.4
Parang nalaman ng journalist na mayroong gano'ng nangyari?
04:59.7
That he or she was being impersonated?
05:03.0
Yung agency yung nakalaman. So flinag sa colleagues dito sa Pilipinas ng government agency.
05:11.8
Okay. Ano pa yung iba example? Yung mga nakakita nyo. Kasi nakalagay dito,
05:15.0
optic and messages to journalists from fake or suspicious email addresses.
05:20.6
Ayan, kasama ka dyan.
05:25.4
Here, we received, and kasama rin ako dito, we received emails from this specific address or person.
05:34.7
And tell me, Ian, kung pareha ba yung experience mo?
05:37.8
Kasi ako, I received it twice. Supposedly, with somebody of the same name, pero each email had a different email address.
05:47.8
Na medyo suspicious, kind of spammy nga yung domain, kasi magkaiba yung domain or something along those lines.
05:55.4
So parang unang red flag yun. And if we got the same email, Ian, it was trying to get journalists to write about Vietnam occupation in South China Sea.
06:08.5
So kaya we should talk about this. And kaya rin namin linabas yung statement na to.
06:12.9
So that journalists are aware na medyo, it might be a little more widespread than we actually think it is.
06:18.4
So we're trying to get a rough headcount of how many people got it.
06:21.7
So sa pagkakaalam ko naman, wala namang journalist na...
06:25.4
na pumatol or some people tried to probe and the person didn't respond or hindi ma-verify yung identity.
06:33.1
So hindi naman nilang nagawa yung mission nila to sway the news agenda.
06:38.4
But it's definitely important that we talk about it.
06:41.6
Kasi once we started talking about it, we also realized na we were all getting the same email but from different email addresses.
06:49.5
Isa rin yung red flag in order for us to be able to tell.
06:53.9
That this is not an organic operation. Hindi siya organic na whistleblower.
07:01.3
Dito sa mga viewers natin, baka hindi sila masyadong nakaka-relate sa specific na nangyari na yun.
07:07.0
Kasi pag journalist, nakakatanggap kami ng mga tips kung saan saan. And of course, we verify those tips.
07:13.0
Pero in this particular case na binabanggit ni Regine, pareho pala kami ng pinag-uusapan.
07:17.3
We received an email from this suspicious account. Sinasabi, parang ano siya eh, kung tinititili ka.
07:23.9
Diba? Parang gusto niya, uy meron akong scoop sa'yo. Diba? Isulat niyo to. Tapos nandoon na lahat ng detalye.
07:30.3
Diba? So kung hindi ka nag-iisip, okay na to. Hindi ka nag-verify, pwede mo namang isulat. Diba?
07:35.8
Pero mukha siyang consistent doon sa Chinese propaganda na nilalayo yung heat away from China papunta sa Vietnam.
07:44.0
Bakit yung Vietnam hindi niyo pinag-iinitan? Parang ganun yung tono niya. Diba?
07:47.8
Oo. Tapos very ano pa siya eh. May isang part ng email na parang,
07:53.9
I'm a concerned Filipino citizen. Pero Filipino ba talaga yung nagsulat nito?
07:59.1
Kasi medyo sketchy yung email, ganun. Yung isa medyo may typo sa Filipino name.
08:05.2
So kaya medyo red flag. Tapos ayaw magpakita in person or to verify yung actual identity.
08:13.8
Oo nga eh. Pinaghihirapan pa nila eh. Magbasa ka lang ng ilang columnist na rito eh.
08:18.8
Out and out naman yung pagiging Chinese propagandist.
08:23.9
Diba? Grabe no? Dumidiskarte pa sa backdoor kasi yung iba eh.
08:29.7
Anyway, ano pa yung mga nakakita ng example? So much so that you had to raise this in a formal statement.
08:35.0
Ano pa yung ibang napansin nyo?
08:37.4
Well, yung isang na-mention din namin sa statement namin ay may member kami na nakapag-record ng attempted hack sa kanyang account.
08:45.7
But I have to clarify iyan. At sinabi rin namin ito sa statement namin.
08:49.8
Ang pina-flag lang ng Google or ng email server ay,
08:53.9
attempted hack from a government. We don't really know which government it is.
08:59.4
So that's just something to be mindful of.
09:04.2
It could be any government pretty much.
09:07.9
And that's why we added the qualifier na hindi pa clear ang source ng threats.
09:12.1
But if you put all of these cases together, then it's something just to be mindful about.
09:20.1
Hindi naman natin sinasabi that,
09:22.6
we don't want to throw people into a panic or say that this is something that people are falling for.
09:30.1
Sa pagkakaalam naman namin na aagapan, quote-unquote, yung ganitong influence operations
09:37.2
because people just don't fall for them or journalists just don't fall for them, at least so far.
09:42.2
So hindi pa gaano ka-sophisticated yung mga operations na ito.
09:48.4
There is an article that came out from the Foreign Publication.
09:52.6
Wired recently, about why China is bad at this information operations.
09:59.4
Generally, for example, in 2020, there was a network also that Facebook found that was traced to China.
10:09.0
And it was a series of Facebook accounts na may AI na profile picture,
10:15.2
promoting Chinese propaganda on West Philippine Sea, also promoting certain politicians.
10:21.2
Pero madali silang...
10:22.6
So it's kind of, so far, if you have a keen eye, if you're able to know,
10:30.8
and if you look at the emails that are reaching out to you, if you look at yung trend,
10:37.4
madali naman sabihin na, okay, troll ito, or okay, hindi ito legit.
10:42.0
But the reason why we wanted to publicize this is just to make people aware
10:47.1
that this is a phenomenon that is happening.
10:49.4
So that if it happens to you,
10:51.7
it's like there's...
10:52.6
Pero ano eh, they're throwing stuff at the wall, no?
10:54.7
And they're seeing what sticks.
10:56.8
So people should know that this is actually happening.
10:60.0
So that if something lands on their inbox, alam nila that it could be something suspicious or spammy.
11:06.6
Oo, pero that's true, no?
11:07.9
And we cannot underestimate China's capability as far as this information is concerned.
11:12.7
Ito, very concrete example.
11:13.9
Diba recently, merong lumabas na YouTube video, I don't know if you saw it, pero na-takedown.
11:20.7
Dine-de-fake yung voice ni...
11:22.6
President Bongbong Marcos.
11:24.8
Basically, parang halos gusto niya mag-declare ng gera against China.
11:28.8
Yung parang, ano, tawad dito, ordering military action.
11:33.5
Buti na takedown.
11:34.3
Kasi clearly peke, pero walang mukha yun, no?
11:38.5
Tapos, yung sa mga mahilig dito sa NBA, ah, NBA.
11:42.8
NBA, National Basketball Association.
11:45.3
Diba natala yung Lakers sa first round ng NBA playoffs against Denver.
11:51.5
Meron lumalabas na video.
11:52.4
Meron lumalabas na video si Lebron James at saka yung coach nila, si Darvin Hamm.
11:56.2
Grabe, sinisisi mga players, sinisisi isa't isa.
11:60.0
Na alam mo, ordinarily, hindi nila sasabihin.
12:02.4
Pero basically, that's a voice deep fake.
12:05.3
Ang galing ng bibig, no?
12:06.6
Unless talaga i-analyze mo yung bibig, mukha siyang, ano, very believable.
12:10.3
Boses ni Lebron James, boses ni Darvin Hamm, the coach.
12:14.3
So, yung ganyan, diba?
12:15.6
Siyempre, alam mo naman ang China to, eh.
12:17.6
Pero, kumaga, hindi lahat may keen eye, lalo pag nakita agad, diba?
12:20.4
Tapos, papasukan pa natin yung, ano,
12:22.4
confirmation bias, diba?
12:24.2
Minsan, mahirap talaga mag-double check pag
12:25.8
aligned yung napanood mo, nadinig mo, doon sa iniisip mo, eh.
12:28.9
So, yung pag ganyan, paano nyo ba dinidiskartehan yan?
12:32.5
Well, may mga, ano, no, Ian, since na-mention mo na,
12:35.0
AI is just going to get smarter
12:37.0
and it's just going to get more sophisticated.
12:39.8
So, kahit na sabihin natin yung mga operator
12:42.2
hindi masyadong sophisticated sa style nila,
12:45.0
the technology might become more sophisticated.
12:48.5
Kaya, it's still important na mag-subscribe tayo sa mga mainstream media.
12:52.4
Kasi sila yung magpa-fact-check talaga
12:54.4
ng mga ganitong phenomenon.
12:56.6
Buti nga yung na-mention mo yung deepfake na agapan nga siya.
12:59.7
Actually, hindi ko nga siyang napanood, eh.
13:01.2
I just heard about it na lang on the news.
13:04.7
And tayo naman as journalists,
13:06.5
we should also be careful, no, to kind of like
13:08.9
strike a proper balance.
13:12.0
So, yung advice ko siguro for journalists and for
13:14.4
even for government officials as well,
13:16.0
anyone who's working in this kind of
13:18.4
information-spreading capacity na official,
13:21.7
it's very important na even when you're fact-checking something,
13:25.7
if you're calling out itong mga propaganda or ano,
13:28.7
huwag silang bigyan ng engagement.
13:30.5
So, don't directly quote-tweet them sana or ano,
13:34.3
better to screen cap tapos lagyan ng graphic na parang fact-check type.
13:39.2
May mga ganong guidelines, di ba, pag fact-checker ka
13:41.6
because you don't want to drive traffic
13:44.2
dun sa source ng disinformation.
13:48.5
So, that's one way.
13:51.7
That journalists and people who spread information
13:55.0
officially, in an official capacity, can be mindful.
13:59.1
Dun sa, ano, sa grupo nyo, sa FOCAP,
14:01.2
concerned ba kayo na sa possible infiltration naman?
14:04.8
Kasi, you are an organization of foreign news organizations
14:09.2
covering Philippine issues, di ba?
14:12.2
Basically, paano ko ma-infiltrate naman kaya kunwari ng
14:14.9
Chinese spy na nagpapanggap na journalist?
14:17.7
Ano yung mga protocols nyo dyan, yung mga safeguards nyo?
14:21.6
Yan yung application process ng FOCAP, I would say.
14:25.1
We have an application form and we have certain requirements
14:28.1
for members to be able to stay in the org every year.
14:31.9
At isa dun sa mga requirements, Christian,
14:34.1
apart from the fact na kailangan practicing journalist ka
14:37.4
at vetted ka by an agency,
14:41.1
is that you also have to be vetted by a board member
14:43.8
or other people inside of the org.
14:46.3
So, this is a process na ina-approve ng board every year.
14:49.6
We really go through each of the members.
14:51.6
And we also need the endorsement of an agency as well.
14:57.2
So, parang may mga ganong process naman kami
14:59.1
to avoid that from happening.
15:02.3
And I remember, di ba, there was an instance na
15:04.7
pati kayo sinisi ng journalist, hindi lang pala kayo.
15:07.9
Yung mga journalist na embedded doon sa mga resupply missions
15:12.1
ng Pilipinas, sa Iongin for instance.
15:15.7
Ang sinasabi nung China, di ba, sa pahayag nila,
15:18.6
na nag-i-invento raw.
15:20.4
Manipulated yung mga...
15:21.4
Images, whatever.
15:24.4
Paano ba dapat yung...
15:25.4
Ano ba yung approach ng FOCAP?
15:27.1
Kunwari, in-embed kayo doon sa resupply mission.
15:30.0
Ano yung mindset nyo going in?
15:33.2
So, it's just like the same as a local journalist,
15:37.4
I would say, Ian.
15:38.3
Pero, syempre, sa FOCAP kasi,
15:40.6
for quite a while, hindi talagang pumapayag yung government na
15:44.3
siguro for safety reasons or whatever other risk reasons,
15:48.7
it took a while for the government na pumayag na may foreigner talaga na mag-e-embed.
15:55.1
So, usually, kami yung nag-e-embed.
15:56.6
Yung mga Pinoy na staff or yung mga local na hire
15:59.6
on behalf of the foreign.
16:02.0
In which case, the dynamic is really just like
16:05.6
reporting for a local outlet.
16:08.4
So, we go in, we immerse ourselves doon,
16:13.6
and we get to witness the same as what a local journalist would
16:17.3
and as what the...
16:18.7
The Coast Guard also does, which is yung mga water cannon,
16:21.6
yung harassment, yung cutting ng China sa West Philippine Sea.
16:25.8
At kaya namin nasabi, Ian,
16:28.7
na-release namin yung statement na yun.
16:30.2
I think that was around last month or within the last couple of months
16:33.8
na inakusahan kami ng Chinese foreign ministry spokesman
16:39.4
and ng embassy na nag-e-invented or manipulate namin yung video.
16:44.1
Masasabi namin na with confidence that that is simply not true.
16:47.0
And that's why we...
16:48.7
We have to release that statement.
16:50.0
Dahil ang isang embed in West Philippine Sea ay
16:54.6
medyo buwis-buhay siya na assignment, no?
16:57.5
It's a high-risk hostile assignment.
17:00.4
And we've gone through the process.
17:02.7
We can definitely say that it's not true at all
17:06.8
that journalists invent or manipulate the video
17:10.1
that you see out of the West Philippine Sea.
17:14.2
Buti malinaw yan, no?
17:15.6
Kasi isa yun sa mga ginagamit to reinforce the...
17:18.7
the disinformation by the Chinese side, no?
17:21.8
Well, anyway, maraming salamat sa iyo, Regine,
17:23.5
for joining us dito sa Facts First sa Uulite, no?
17:27.2
Masaya ang kausap sa Regine.
17:28.6
Medyo formal lang siya ngayon.
17:31.2
Maraming salamat, Ian.
17:32.7
If I can add siguro one thing also.
17:36.9
Influence operations definitely will not stop anytime soon.
17:41.1
But what we can do is that we can learn to identify them
17:44.3
and also inform ourselves.
17:45.7
Pero yung online influence operations,
17:48.7
isang aspect lang yan ng...
17:50.1
isang aspect lang yan ng malign influence,
17:53.5
ng foreign interference.
17:55.0
Meron ding offline.
17:56.3
And baka nga in the Philippine context,
17:58.6
that's something that we should watch out for more.
18:01.2
Another discussion for another time.
18:06.4
Offline disinformation.
18:08.1
Maraming salamat, Regine Kabato for joining us.
18:11.7
Siya po yung Vice President of Foreign Correspondents Association
18:14.3
of the Philippines.
18:15.7
Thank you, Regine.
18:18.7
Kung gusto nyo po itong video na ito,
18:19.8
pakilike at share na lang po
18:21.0
para mas parangyay pong makakita at makapanood.
18:23.7
Kung gusto nyo po makibalita,
18:25.3
follow nyo na rin po ako sa aking mga social media accounts
18:27.6
na nakasulat po sa screen.
18:29.7
Pwede rin po kayo magpadala ng super thanks,
18:31.7
super like, super chat, at super sticker sa YouTube
18:34.2
saka Facebook stars po.
18:36.3
Alam nyo po, malayo po mararating ito
18:38.0
para makagawa po kami ng mas maraming video
18:40.6
na makatutulong po sa pagpapakalat ng tamang impormasyon
18:44.1
para sa bawat Pilipino.
18:45.7
Kada like, subscribe, follow, at share ay pagsuporta po.
18:48.7
Sa tunay na independent journalism sa bansa.
18:52.2
Maraming maraming salamat po.
